How would you end an unsatisfying relationship? Yes, I am afraid of the loss/grief that will follow. And I do value his friendship but the romantic links are unfilling. Even, ugh, the sex is often unfilling and that's just.... crazy!!

As well, we are both Cancer suns so it's a very parental exchange, intense.

Would you look to your chart for clues? Cold turkey?
How do you say goodbye to someone that you value but you know your values are different? Someone that you love, but you know....something is really missing....

I need to move on but am afraid to move on-- on so many levels.

Is this a Saturn Libra topic :) ?

yeah, it's a Saturn in Libra topic.

I would try to answer this for you moonpluto but I don't think I am equipped without charts. You'd be amazed to read your post from my perspective. PURE water.

(((moonpluto)))

I know someone is going to come along with good advice.

"Pure water" :)

I would post my chart if i knew how. If a kind soul wants to help me out, I'm 7/9/70
9:54 am
Providence, Rhode Island.

Thanks for the hug!

I don't have any good advice... just a question. Is it important to take into account the fact that Mars in Leo is retrograde? I keep making a BIG deal out of that these days, but I'm not sure I'm right to... All I know is that a lot of people seem suddenly dissatisfied, coming to the conclusion that their needs are not being satisfied, that they are not being properly valued, or whatnot - and are ready to WALK without a second thought.

Either Mars retrograde is exposing something important that should be acted on, or maybe it's helping one to deal with frustrations without being impulsive about cutting ties, or...? How can we tell which?  My instinct would be to wait until Mars is direct before breaking up, but by then maybe the dissatisfaction won't be at a high enough level, and one will be left with reluctantly staying in an unhappy relationship. Maybe see if Mars is aspecting any of your planets, and especially in relation to mars and the moon, to see if this retrograde is dampening your sex and love life?

(And then, once again, would that mean that Mars is revealing something, or merely posing a costly and distracting detour? ) 

MP, if I can get some stuff pulled up online when I get home, I'll post it for you.

If nobody beats me to it :-D

Isn't your chart in one of the classes? Point me to it? Or tell me what name I would have put it under so I can find it because I am sure it was in the sun sign class, yes?

Thank you.........
Mars nearly conjuncted my Venus than backed away. It's been unsatisfying for a while. Practical concerns kept me there. Practical concerns and fear-- and love, actually. We are close friends above and beyond the romantic failings--

And that feeling of: there will never be another, or may never be another. End of the road!

Shannon, thanx :)

Oh thank you, Elsa. C'est moi.

To end it I would guess to look to the 8th house.. which would mean fast like an aries.. might be why you feel like doing it now with mars in leo which is making you aware of the hidden aspects of what's going on (and the unsatisfying sex) as mars transits your 12th. Staying friends would be your way of clinging.. or the excuse to stay. And the wound of being agressive and killing it off - because you know that being agressive can result in loss - may have been hindering you.

Btw with pisces ruling your 7th and mars in your 12th you should be quite in touch at the moment with how it is real vs fantasy. And that it can (may be time to) dissolve. Are you busy with work or is he? Neptune is transiting your 6th and in exchange with uranus in the 7th.. which indicates freedom in relationship.. or quick exits.. esp as uranus treks towards your 8th.

How to get over it? Fill your life with other friends as your security blanket.. and express yourself through art and practice dating (capricorn = commit to it). With pluto moving through your 5th moving to opposition (for a while yet) you have a great opportunity - especially once uranus is in the 8th - to explore new energy that may actually satisfy your sag 4th house, and venus in leo. Pay attention. Some WILL be fantasy and you will have to get used to letting them go - philosophically and quickly in order to make the most of it - to find the best friend/love that you ultimately long for.

Instead of cancer holding onto past feelings.. you have the opportunity for real love - capricorn and saturn in libra. And I think real love may be an evolved sag/scorp who can aid you with boundaries.. rather than a fellow cancer who clings.

But I'm amature at this.. just phiiosophising (sp?) and connecting the dots. Get the book I a mentioned in the other thread.. amazing. :)

Oh Liz you are far from amateur. You're a deep soul with lots to say. Thank you. Need to reread this a few. Yeah, I cling. He is my security blanket big time. (I am embarrassed at all the typos in my posts - please pardon me! I kept writing unfilling instead of unfulfilling - like he's some kind of insubstantial lunch lol unfilling)

And yes, been busy with work, him especially, but me too--

Hi MP

I sent my read to you via message.

Moonpluto, I just noticed that transiting Saturn is exact on your natal Uranus and quincunx NN. This might explain the fears that have been keeping you from breaking free of something you know isn't working, and of the future.

I can't give you any advice about the breaking up part because I'm hopeless at that, but I do think looking at the upside of Saturn could help clear some of these fears and allow you to look at things more positively.  For example, you want to transform the relationship, rather than end it. And you have Jupiter in Libra in the 2nd so you benefit from Libra values, in which Saturn is exalted. So I'd look to your Jupiter to help you with this.

I don't know, youre a writer aren't you?  Tell the story of how you committed to your future by setting new boundaries in a precious relationship that allowed you to release yourself and him into that future....?

Right Fucking On Opal! 

That is the window of grace in the chart!

Hi moonpluto. You're getting great input. I noticed that another exact aspect from Jupiter running w/the Fog Machine (Neptune/Jupiter/Chiron) in the 6th house. FogM is filling in the empty leg of your t-square, offering support to that pattern. (ruler of the 4th and 7th) is making a sextile to itself, and at 26 could anchor, balance, provide awareness (opposition) to the apex planet, . Trick is, the trick always is,  not to get swamped by Neptune.  I wish you well.

 edit: here is where I got the bit about support from t-square transits http://www.therealastrology.com/HTML/FAQS/AspectPatterns.html#Grand%20Cross

 OMG! Im not even going to look at the chart any more, all I can see is that you are a precious moon baby and I do not have the heart to let all my scorpio look at it any deeper than that, i've been hard on people lately.

I will play Libra here and ask have you talked about it? I mean with him? Come up for a little air and start a dialog. It is possible to negotiate a satisfying breakup with emotional honesty and respect.

ps I find "unfilling" sex very unfulfilling as well

Thank you for all these great words. I will come back later in more detail! Y'all are so helpful to listen and give and comment--

Notatirem, you can let your scorpio out, if you want. I promise I won't get all sensitive on you.

I will message you back, Chami.

MP--I haven't been around here much and don't have a lot of time to comment these days, but I just wanted to send along my hugs. 

PS with Merc rx it might be best to contemplate before making any decisions? I hope that you come to the best conclusion for yourself and for your relationship. xoxo 

Thanks -- true. Mercury AND Mars retrgrade. I will try to relax and not be hasty, impatient, all Marsy. I know I'll only regret it.
I hope to respond more personally later. I have a cold and am working so worn out. Just saying I appreciate everyone for this feedback.

Update: welll, it's happening. I'm doing it. And... it sucks. But necessary? I keep thinking I will get a call or email but am doing this cold turkey to cut off the energy from him which is so potent and how it went on for so long.  I am trying to amputate. This is the longest relationship I've ever had and I'm almost 40.... the most sex I ever had with one person.....And it's a long time coming.I have tried to end it many times but I think this time is for real--

 Yes, I am accepting all cyber hugs

Moonpluto,

Good luck.  Break-ups tend to suck, yes, but it's going to be a nice year--so you never know what might happen right around the corner for you.  My last girlfriend was a Cancer, and although we'd attempted to break up in a friendly way, she said some cutting things at the actual break-up that were pretty low, to which I'd responded with a letter after considering the things she'd said.  Long story short, my letter destroyed any hopes of a friendship afterwards.  Oh well!  Once again, my Scorpio magic burns down the house!

Thank you nutsy-

At least i have my work to semi-distract me today. Today is... Day1--

I wrote a post on my facebook but then deleted it. Saying i was going to do this breakup with dignity: using meditation, cigarettes, and alchohol. Truth is i feel lousy. And scared. As i wrote above, he and i are both cancers -- so it's like losing a parent, not just a good friend/love--

In addition to meditation, cigs and alcohol, don't forget karaoke at the lezzie bar, thats integral to a break up done right.

(((Moonpluto)))

(((moonpluto))) keep your strength up girl!

You know, I tried dating another Libra once and also found it a very unfulfilling relationship also.  I believe that we need someone different from ourselves to fill in our 'blank spots', so-to-speak.  He and I were just too much alike in too many ways, and while it was a 'pleasant' relationship to be in, there was just something missing.  I couldn't quite put my finger on it, but then our relationship only last for about 18 months.  Had I had more time with him I probably would've figured it out.  It made the break up difficult though because neither of could say exactly what was making us unhappy....we just were.

Only you truly know in your heart if this is the right decision for you.  Sometimes I get a little caught up in reading my chart and my scopes, etc. and I forget to just close my eyes and feel.  It is easy to rely on outside forces sometimes to give us the impetus to act; but this is unnecessary in most cases because the strength to act is inside.  I have a picture that hangs over my bed which says " We tend to seek happiness, when happiness is actually a choice."  I am sure it's not a new saying....but it speaks to me and it helps that I am reminded of it everyday!  Good Luck!

(((moonpluto))))

I don't know what else to say, except I hope you are as kind to yourself during this breakup as you were to me during mine. 

Thank you notatirem, daisynymph
Kash thank you, i'm glad i was kind. That's nice to know i didnt just analyze your chart (cant muster an lol yet)

((((((((moonpluto)))))))))

Ohh I can only imagine how difficult this is for you. Remember to replace the cling with other comforts.. reach out to friends.. let them know you need them a bit right now but spread your water around so that there is not just one friend.. your moon or 4th house is in sag right? maybe try yoga and go for loooooong walks to help you. Long walks from coffee shop to coffee shop. Walk and then a hot beverage for comfort. Wish I were there to take you out. :)

(((moonpluto)))

remember that while this is no doubt difficult, by releasing what isn't working, you are freeing both you and him. it's not an easy thing to do, but ultimately a respectful and loving choice...

(((moonpluto)))

You guys are amazing - thank you--
Your compassion is warming me
Back to work...

Goddess, u r right - he never would have ended it-- Liz, i wish you were nearby. I could use some of that Libran beauty and grace-- thanks interior
Okay now back to work--

Moonpluto, I'm so sorry to hear about this but glad to know that you bit the bullet and went through with the near-impossible. I hear you about that Cancer energy in a relationship. It's nearly impossible to extrapolate yourself from.

I also can relate big-time to what Daisynymph said. When I dated a fellow Libra it definitely felt more like a close friendship than a romantic, sexual affair. I thought it was that we had so much similarity in our charts in general or that it was all that air. Figured two water signs or two earth signs would fare better in the chemistry department than two air signs. But, what do I know. Every day is a new discovery.

Anyway, I'm not one to give relationship advice right now but you do have my sympathy! A hug for you. Stay strong! (someone from here said that to me recently so now I'm saying it to you).

And yeah Liz, Sag rules 4th -- never actually thought of that before duh the moon connection to Sg thru that.... gives me something to think about...

(((mp)))

I'll skip the usual jejune advice about one day at a time.

You have friends here who are all super supportive.  Thanks for letting us buoy you up a bit.

Connecting the dots of your chart I'd say you need to date a libra/sag/pisces like myself. We'd go for a walk, dreaming up your next partner and i'd let you pack a picnic and take care of the details. :P With saturn in libra I think it's going to be about recognizing your other half and moving in to partner with them. Very challenging to say the least.

Moving in as stepping forward.. despite anxieties etc.

Keep your chin up, moonpluto,

Each day you proceed forward and put some distance from the relationship, you will find more opportunities to branch in new directions, and eventually you will feel the 'new' freedom that post-relationship numbness is kind of denying you right now.

I can't speak much to the astrology, but I just went through something similar after a 20 year marriage and I can say a couple things:

1. Every ending is a also a new beginning. When you're feeling down, try to remember that you left because you needed to start something new, something healthy for YOU.

2. Because every ending is a new beginning, HOW you leave is important. It sets the tone for what follows.

3. Again, since every ending is a new beginning, I would recommend to wait until the Merc retro is over. You might also want to wait until other retros are over... consult Elsa or somebody else who knows more about transits, etc. Just my own thought about waiting for the retros to be over... I have no basis for it except my own experience.

One of the things I found very interesting about my divorce is that the actual legal part is not so much a separation as it is a NEW AGREEMENT between the parties! The new agreement supercedes the old one and that is how the old one is eliminated. I found this fascinating and it reinforces what I already know and keep repeating: every ending is a new beginning.

Take care and good luck.

***(((MoonPluto)))***