It will come as no surprise that I have a very quirky and intense daughter.  Those of you who have followed me here know that my older kids have lived with me at times and with their dad at times.  My daughter was here for the last year and recently went back to live at her dad's because she missed her school friends.  

My current concern as I am watching her grow up has to do with boys.  She seems to be in the process of breaking up with her boyfriend in favor of a secret racecar driving, compulsive lying bad boy.  Boyfriend is an Aquarius sun, Libra asc, Taurus moon who has loved her since they were children.  They seemed to be a fantastic match and I thought perhaps they were the one in a million who find each other young.  

I've recently realized that he was painting her into a very traditional image and she was starting to rebel.   For instance, he doesn't understand why she wouldn't want him to ask her dad if he could marry her.  First of all, she's 16 and he's 15 and bandying about words like marriage would make any Virgo sun/Aq moon girl twitchy.  But also important is the fact that I have raised her to know that women are not property to be handed over from father to husband.  Marriage is about partnership, not ownership.  Boyfriend worships at her feet and doesn't understand how his traditional ideas limit her freedom.  He would do anything for her.  

Now I love him.  He is good to my girl and he calls me Ma.  His family and ours are close... connected through my career and friendship.  But she's my daughter and I want her to follow her heart.  I also want her not to die with racecar boyfriend at the wheel, be date raped or even have her heart broken badly by someone less than honest.  Her father is not helpful.  I have been watching the situation, trying to determine from a distance whether or not she is taking stupid risks.  If I alert her father unnecessarily he will overreact, possibly causing her to become more secretive and take more risks than she would have.  It's a very delicate situation.   She is currently (finally) talking to me about it.  She knows I'm worried about her safety and I arm her with as much information about boys and life as I can.  I know she's bound to have emotional ups and downs and she will learn some lessons the hard way.  

I'm here calling on the vast wisdom that hangs out around here and hoping you all will be able to advise me in how best to support her and guide her.  She is 16, driving her own car (that stupid dad bought for her) and just a couple of years away from being completely outside of my ability to control.  I want to use what influence I still have to keep her as safe as possible. 

I really feel for you, Lupa.  I have not yet been through this age with my son, so I can't speak with that true been-there experience.  However, as a Sun-Uranus with very Aquarian-flavored parents and siblings, maybe I can speak to the moon part.  What pops to mind has both a non-reassuring and a reassuring component.

1) Non-reassuring:  she is already outside your ability to control.  Her rebelling against *something* is unavoidable, and experimenting with dropping the boyfriend who has always been there sounds like the natural and maybe least harmful way to start.  Her Aqua boyfriend probably instinctively gets this.

2) Reassuring: But Saturn is there with her moon, at home in Aquarius!  This, plus her sensible Virgo, strikes me as the ultimate natural check on crazy rebellion.  She's practical.  And right there on her IC, this practicality feels like an inborn part of her.

I know it is very hard not to worry (especially with the car, I remember that story), but probably the more you try to fix, other than the arming her with information and strong support, I have a gut feeling it'll speed up the rebellion itch.  I think her sensibility is going to guide her strongly, though.  ((((Lupa))))

Lupa, I can't give motherly advice, so I won't try on that front, but since you posted her chart, thought I could at least help a little by looking.

Do you think the Uranus transit to her Asc could have something to do with these changes in her environment? That has to be a bit of rebelling influence, even as a trine.

I can tell you're such a caring mother... ((Lupa))

"They seemed to be a fantastic match and I thought perhaps they were the one in a million who find each other young."

Thats a very sweet sentiment, but... well...  its a little dreamy.  Buts its so nice to dream sometimes, isn't it?

I'm also looking at Uranus.  As well as Venus transiting the 5th... in Aries! And Mars is up there touching her venus. ("hehe, can I touch your venus?") That sounds like a racecar boyfriend transit to me alright.  

"I also want her not to die with racecar boyfriend at the wheel, be date raped or even have her heart broken badly"

Lets see, the first two are totally legit things to pour some energy into preventing.  The third (the broken heart) is an enevitability of life in a human body.  You can talk about it all you want, but you will never be totally prepared for that one and theres no stopping it, so I would drop it from my list of worries just for worrying effeciency.  You can worry better when your worries are more practical. Just know that when it does happen you can be the soft shoulder to cry on and that is worth more than anything.

Thank you both.  I think you're right Jessica, that she's not really under my control now.  At the same time I don't think I can throw my hands up in the air and give it all up.  I also think you're right about her generally sensible nature.  

Alicia, yes you may be onto something and maybe as a trine it will have a beneficial effect.  There's also the pileup in the sky now that is hitting her 4th house.  Probably also beneficial but unsettling.

I guess I didn't really get specific with what I'm looking for but I would love insight into the transits that are affecting her now.  My approach has been to glean information from any source I can and never reveal those sources.  Scorpio ascendant with Pluto conjunct would freeze me out in a second if she thought I was snooping on her.  I am doing everything I can to live up to her belief that I know everything.  Oh and if you saw the shiny chicken parenting thread you've probably guessed that those funny comments were related to conversations I was having with her.  I am also very careful not to leak information she offers me.  It is tricky tricky and complicated.  I think the story will have a happy ending and I think my daughter is more like me than I was ready to admit.  

Lupa,

The only thing I can add, from my mind and heart, is just to do your best communicating with her and let her know she can be open with you.  As long as she trusts you she will rely on you...when the chips are down, she will know she can go to you.  It sounds like you are leaning that way, unless I'm misunderstanding my impressions from your post, so just keep your dialogue with your daughter going, let her be free with what she says to you, and as she grows older she can only love you and respect you more for being the best Mom you can be.

As I tell everyone, I'm a nut, so take these words with a grain of salt and don't hate me if you think I'm full of shit.  

Thanks Nota.  I agree the dreamy dream was dreamy.  I knew that and I even told her that given the choices I probably would have gone for the damn racecar boyfriend.  She seemed REALLY happy with the football player, clark kent type boy for a while.  

And I really know the heartbreak thing is something we all experience too.  She has more sense than a great many adult women I know so I suppose she needs to get the practical experience to go with it now.  

Thanks Nutsy.  :)  I don't think you're full of shit.  I'm very open with her.  Sometimes she wishes I would shut up already I'm sure.  :)

It's over my head, but I just wanted to send some lucky vibes your way.  (((Lupa)))  Good luck, behbeh!

PS -- I adore the sunglasses over the name! 

Thanks SaDiablo and I liked the glasses too.  :)  Photobucket has stickers you can put on photos.  It was the easiest way to edit out the details.  This chart is incognito!  lol

Hi Lupa,

Kind of new here and also to deeper astro study, but wanted to send some mama support your way. You sound like such a present, sincere, and authentic Mom;) You're daughter is lucky.

My girl is an Aquarian Moon too. She's NOT a full teenager yet (just 12), but I've always sensed that she's so profoundly independant to the core, I really can choose to release any "big picture" worries...BUT it's not easy!

Oh, also about your daughter...aren't Pluto in Scorpio kids here for intense, transformational (personal/ interpersonal) experiences?

Smiles and hugs, X

(((Lupa))) 

OK, I've "been there" 3 times, with boys, but even though some of the worries are different, overall the effect on the parents is the same.  You've given her a certain amount of freedom (driving/boyfriends/the usual 16 year old stuff).  The way I look at it is you can either make yourself crazy with worry, or give yourself, and your child, some credit that you've taught them pretty much all you can and that they've hopefully listened and taken it to heart.  You will never stop worrying about her, but as Nota said above, you can choose your worries....

As an Aqua moon myself, and with a mom who has basically NO air in her chart, it really helped when my mom didn't hover, she made me feel like she trusted me and respected my choices.  Because when she hovered and worried and dared to indicate that she thought I was making a mistake it felt like an insult to my intelligence.  (Inner thoughts being something like "Did you raise me to be an idiot?  Do you really think I want to get pregnant?  Do you think I can't tell when a guy is just out for one thing? etc.!!!!)  In know she tried to back off and give me space, but somehow she wasn't able to do it when it came to boys.  Lucky for her I was heeding her advice (mostly -- heh heh) but I wasn't going to give her the pleasure of knowing it, which is sad. By the time I was really dating, I told her absolutely the bare minimum about my love life, because I was so pissed at her I felt she didn't deserve to know. 

So it's really encouraging to hear that you two talk, especially about this new racecar driver.  Hopefully you're mostly just listening, and only giving advice when asked  She may not tell you everything, and haha -- do you REALLY want to know everything??  But if she feels comfortable in talking to you, at least you'll probably know what you really need to know and will be able to get at least some sleep at night. 

Listen, listen, listen.  Let her know you're there for her, no matter what.  Let her know that if she ever finds herself in a bad situation, that you will be there to help her, no questions asked.  (I know that's a stretch, but hopefully she'll give you some answers later without you having to ask!)  She will undoubtedly mess  up big-time at some point -- try not to act like it's the end of the world, because she'll probably feel like an utter failure as it is.  You will too, but it's best to move on and learn from the mistake.  Three strikes (for minor offenses) is a good plan.  Third stirke, well, don't feel bad if you have to lay down the law, because then it's clear that they need another lesson -- they weren't listening and they have to understand that you are simply doing your job, which is being a parent.  Actions have consequences, blah blah blah.

I don't know, I could sit here all day yakking about this!  But from things you've written before as well as in this post, it sounds to me like you've got a good head and are already on the right road with her (and it sounds like she's inherited some of your good sense, too!)  Good luck!

Well, I was going to ask, looks like that excruciatingly slow Neptune-Moon transit for her is over now.... how did that go for her?

She may not tell you everything, and haha -- do you REALLY want to know everything??

Oh god no!  Matter of fact I know more than I wanted to and I'm reasonably sure that the nice boy was much too conservative for her.  She's a smart cookie and she has an 8 year old brother.  She was there when he was born and has helped raise him.  I told her recently that I want her to be careful of the situations she puts herself in because we aren't done raising Aubrey.  :)

I'm Gemini sun...  definitely not smothery.  But that Pluto conjunct her ascendant... she's secretive like crazy.   

Jessica, I imagine that she's been pretty confused about her feelings for the last few years because of that.  My husband is Aquarius sun and she has played out a lot of that confusion with him.  He adores her and she is 100% his daughter in his heart.  She alternates between acting really friendly with him and ignoring him completely.  I moved to be with him and then he and I have moved twice together so her home with me has been in constant flux.  I don't suppose that she'll have a solid home though as it's moving away from her moon but into her 4th house.  Good thing she likes adventure and is pretty much at home where ever she finds herself. 

I can't see the chart well on my phone but wanted to echo others in what a wonderful mom you are.

Virgo sun/aqua moon is an interesting combo, isnt it :)

Hopefully i can comment more later when i can see the damn thing on my pc at home.

Lupa I just wanted to tell you how much you remind me of my own mom.  Shes a gemini with an 8th house moon so you guys have a very similar vibe.  Shes my best friend. I also have a third house moon like your daughter. Mom and I have an excellent rapport.

I didn't always tell her everything, I've got a ton of Scorpio and well, you know how that goes...

but like pinkminxx said: "Lucky for her I was heeding her advice (mostly -- heh heh) but I wasn't going to give her the pleasure of knowing it, which is sad."

Every time I left the house my mom would lapse into Granny's dutchy baby voice and cry out after me her immortal catchphrase... "Don't get got!"

Thank you Nota.  I think you turned out pretty nifty so that makes me feel really great. 

Am chatting to her on facebook about her teenage love drama.  She's conflicted about racecar boy.  Thinks he might be a player.  Then suddenly she says "I KNOW!!!  I know what to do.  Do your tarot thing!"  Awww...  And she knows I wouldn't fake it up to say what I want it to.  I will snoop all over the place but if I read for her it will be real.  

It's so much more complicated by the fact that she's not living with me now.  I can't tell her not to get got every time she leaves the house.  :(  I think she'll be ok though.  Thank you all for being supportive.  

I'd say buy her a helmet. :)

Her NN is going to love it! She's primed for some real experience. And despite having libra she is very independent (like me).. and should be.. the man who lets her recharge her energy/transform and roam will be the man for her. My mom filled me with all kinds of worry and then detachment.. it led me to a few adventures I may have detoured from had I not been so busy rebelling from the oppressive part.. but overall I've survived.. and am looking forward to the mars in leo and venus/uranus in aries shooting me out there!.. Even while having a grounded perspective at the same time. - The Helmet idea as it were.

The taurus moon fits her 6th house/virgo energy.. and that's not where the wind calls at the moment..I hope she sees through his lies asap and once spring is over is back home again safe and sound. 

Also she should check in with her friends on all dating choices.. does she do that? That would be my biggest advice. And moving to be closer to them because she misses them makes sense being a virgo with moon in aquarius and virgo ruling her 11th. She's like a nurse. Ready to assist with her virgo ways.. but also ready to go on a dime and do things differently. I see doctors without borders. And with aries ruling her 6th.. she needs the rush in a daily routine as well or she will get bored.

Man I'm envious that she has a racecar man. What I wouldn't do for that. But my saturn in cancer makes me shy around the ones that I REALLY like. :P 

((lupa))

Hi Lupa,

I'm a Virgo sun with Aquarius Moon (albeit with a very different chart overall than your daughter's). My immediate thought - just based on what would work for me - is to trust your daughter. Not because she'd necessarily do the right thing (in my case, in fact, sometimes I was clueless, didn't know a lot of things, made a lot of stupid mistakes, had some adventures,  secret loves, etc.), because after all, that's sort of just trusting yourself that you brought her up well - which it sounds like you're doing a really great job. But in my opinion, what would really work for a Virgo/Aquarian girl is to really really trust HER. All the way. When I knew I was trusted (and usually, I was - even though my wise self knew that it was crazy and unjustified at times), that's when I would really do well. I'd take better care of myself knowing others were taking it for granted that I would. It would never occur to me to take advantage of that trust. Just the opposite. I lived up to it.

In other words, an authority figure's trust in me was (and still is, for me) inspiring. And it kept me more on track than any verbal lessons or advice ever could (though I would have loved having a mom who could do tarot readings for me; I have an insatiable need to know stuff!). 

Hope this made some sense. I've got pluto/uranus conjuct my sun in the 10th house and a second house Aqua moon...

i have an aquarius moon.  detached from my mother for nearly seven years once i hit 19. 

and, oddly, she's a gemini, too, but she also has four cancer planets in the eighth house.  smothery.  in a very pluto way.

er, looking back i can see she was trying to protect me.  and she had ample reason to feel so protective.  based on what she saw growing up.  and, well, i've seen a little of the world since, and i understand where she was coming from.  but she made me feel like she thought i was an idiot and refused to allow me to make my own mistakes.  we also both have pluto moon stuff going on, but hers in far tighter orb.  guess the apple really don't fall to far, but i couldn't see it that way then... i wanted excitement!  adventure!  and since i was so mad at her i would do things i knew she'd disapprove of, to "get back at" her, even though she never found out about... most of it.  (98%)  those were, overall, the top stupid things i've done.  "piss of mom's reactionary sensibilities if she knew about it" is not terribly useful motivation for doing something.

i also have saturn/pluto (and, 8 degrees out, saturn/moon) and i've managed to survive some pretty close scrapes by recognizing when i was about to push the stupid bar too far.  for example, i always knew when to stop drinking.  i was very cautious about who i'd trusted, and what i'd do around people i didn't trust (sometimes it was misplaced, but that more from trusting someone else's judgement to be like mine.  oops.)

which is to say, she should have the capacity to rein herself in... possibly, with that pluto on the asc, she's the type to research anything heavily, finding out the dangers, and then go take the risks anyway.  i'm not sure if my thrillseeker is more my aries or my aquarius, but with that jupiter mars... she's got some steam to let off, i'd think.

but, overall.  if she can trust you enough to tell her what's going on in her life... and not to be judgemental (that's where my issues really came in, anyway) then there's a good chance she'll listen to you even if she doesn't express it overtly.  and, yes.  at 16.  my mother really had no control over me.  she exerted authority and i found ways around it. if i cared about it.  so... making sure you're present in her life as someone who cares about her and will tell it like it is and be there for her if she needs it without trying to force her hand... is amazing. 

my mother and i get along MUCH better now.  a lot of it has to do with the simple fact that she now treats me like an autonomous person, rather than someone dependent on her.  my aquarius, at least, hates to feel dependent on anything (even if i am) and, even worse, shackled to something or constrained against acting as my nature inclines.

hope some of this is relevant ;)

((Lupa)).. I can't recall your own chart right now, Lupa..been a while since we chatted over the summer Colisseum time..can u share this info or PM me ..would be interested in the synastry and the composite.. as well as her chart. I also have someone else in touch with me via my website with a similar theme..16yr old daughter..

I was married at 16..and no it didn't work out. How were you at that age?

Sea I think that's really great advice and I will heed it.  She does seem to be pretty smart most of the time. 

Wyrdling, definitely relevant thank you.  And funny you mentioned apples and trees.  I explained the saying to Em a few years ago and now whenever we do something similar she just sighs and says "I know, apples and trees."  Usually punctuated by an eye roll.  :)

Lindiloo, here's my chart.

And here's the composite chart:

I don't mind sharing the stats privately, but didn't want to put her full name and location up there publicly so let me know if you'd like to run different style charts Lindiloo.  (or anyone really)

I was very different at 16.  Always wanted a partner and pined for someone or another when I was single.  On the other hand, when I was 16 I had a 15 year old boyfriend.  The boy she's in the process of breaking up with is a bit more than a year younger than her.  I think I was just much more traditionally minded regarding relationships from a very young age.  I had to grow up a bit before my restlessness took hold.  :)

I was also a fairly devout christian and very torn between wanting to be a good girl and wanting to explore a little bit sexually.   

@Lupa. I was like your daughter at 17. I had a terrible boyfriend that nearly drove my mother insane. I think that situation was the first situation she handled right in her entire parenting live. My mother and I had a very troubled relationship but she knew that it wouldn't do any good to try to prevent the relationship. She always welcomed us in her home because she understood that as long as she remained respectful me I would instinctively respect her back. She did however voice her concern but for the first time in her live she did it in a loving way. I didn't feel critized and always felt I had a home to return to if things went sour. Also she made sure her best friend, who was someone I deeply trusted, kept in touch with so that I had somebody to talk to if Ihad problems in my relationship. I finally broke up with the bastard myself (after two years of him cheating on me and exposing me to a lifestyle of sex drugs and rock and roll). I don't know if I woud have been strong enough to have done so if I didn't know that I had  a home and a mother who didn't judge me. I think in your teens the partners you choose are your way of finding out what we want and need in love. As a parent just be there for your child express concern but don't criticise. Easier said than done..............

Notintofeet, I am probably the most non-judgmental mom you could meet so I think I'm good there.  And honestly I don't think this boy is going to stick around long.  The only thing I've said to my daughter is that I think it's very important that she handle the break up with as much kindness as she can muster because the good boyfriend has been exceptionally good to her.  I'm beginning to suspect that the racecar driving boy was her way of getting free, though I doubt she knows that yet.  

On the other hand, she may be playing me and telling me she isn't sure about him to get me off her back a little.  Even asking me to read cards may have been about appeasing me more than really wanting a reading.  Plutonian mom and daughter express love through good natured mind games apparently.  

And I think that teens and adults figure out what we want through experience.  Each person we are even remotely attracted to or repelled by helps us hone our gold standard and learn how we are in love and what we want.  I tell people that all the time when I read for them.  Failed relationships aren't usually complete failures.  They are just about setting your gold standard and stretching your wings.   

Lupa thanks for posting the charts..I can work out the details from Moon, Saturn and Sun position, no problem.

I so want to say the right thing here..in the right way, and my motivation for doing it is that I have been through many changes as a mother myself, and learned a few things the hard way, mostly about myself.  Such as the fact that I had a bit of a shaky start in life and worked hard to give my kids whatever I could by way of strong foundations, always thinking, well they didn't have my roots, they'll have a smoother time than me, and if they seemed to steer themselves into what I perceived as wrong choices or feared could be dangerous, I spoke up wherever I felt I could.. Did it change a thing? Nope.

My daughter had the best childhood ..she says that, not me. We were like two hearts that beat as one sometimes.. and she was more than my child, we just shared such a deep and easy bond,(which was perhaps the foundation of a future problem time).. she says that she loves the fact that I always spoke with her as someone whose views mattered, counted for something.  

But we still went through a hell of a time that was all about her separating from that closeness, even as she craved it.. leaving a cosy nest is the hardest I guess..as she met her Mr Right at 15, too. She also had a break from him while she chased a few fast cars too..

She has come through some incredibly challenging times in recent years with PLuto through her 7th house Sun and other planets..( and her Mr Safe turned out to be anything but, at times, actually he's forever finding danger and drama yet we now have faith that all is as it's meant to be, he's her husband and we do like him a lot) and I got so angst ridden and at times confused, feeling I'd "lost" that precious bond but not knowing how or why..just screwed myself up..which solved err..??  Then one day I stopped worrying about what i couldn't alter, and you know, I have been the one who benefitted most from that.. but it was a gradual hardwon process. Now she is the girl we knew..and a lot more besides..and actually, now, I'm the one who quietly ensures I have space!

Fact is some of the stuff our kids deal with would be hard for us to take on board as you say, just as we don't want to share it all with ours.. 

My girl has a girl of her own now, and that was always going to be our turning point.. she turned right around and nowadays I'm far more at ease with myself, ergo with her, as I know how to do this thing..  Saturn has returned for her, so its as I'd hoped.

I see your relationship with the bright, intelligent and yes, intense Ms Virgo as strong, see her chart as not as challenged as yours is. See PLuto opposing your Venus, intensifying all of your maternal feelings and need to be there for a daughter who has flown away from your easy, caring Gemini nest, although from what i gather, she's in your life constantly, works with you?  Mine did too for a time and still would in a heartbeat.. you two have such warmth, such love so CLEAR in your charts, and I think she has the foundations she needs, rather than the ones you might wish for her. I see her as needing to be a very independent lady and would not for one minute worry about her finding her way in time.. even if she does have to stumble now and then, it'll show her how to get her balance, give her more strength to be the best she can be as an individual and in parterning. Venus in Leo in her 9th.. and Mars with Jupiter in Libra in 11th.. she'll make herself and you proud..given time and space, which you so clearly give her.

 I think you posted this maybe to gain the clarity an artist might get from stepping back from a lovely portrait.  She's YOUR daughter...she may not be able to be with Mr Safe right now.. but that doesn't mean she'll head off in the racing car .. the shiny yellow convertible after all is HERS.. she will go her own way, I reckon.  That may include career choices over the PLuto trine to her Sun/Mercury.. travel and studies ahead?

My now retired attorney has the Virgo/Libra combo like your daughter, and an Aquarian Moon..she really knew her stuff .. and was good friends with her mum, but always needed her own space..went to Uni at age 16!

You're a lovely mum.. and while you can't protect her as much as you want to..the fact that you do just says tons about you..all good. XX

(((lupa)))

i skipped a lot of what was written on this thread, so sorry if this was covered. :( i'm being bad, shouldn't be hanging here during busy work hours anyway!

this struck me:

"But also important is the fact that I have raised her to know that women are not property to be handed over from father to husband."

i don't really view the "asking the father" ritual like that at all. i see it as showing respect to someone's family. before a girl is married, the man in her life who takes care of her is her dad. sure, girls grow up and stand on their own two feet. BUT... if any sort of catastrophe were to take place, who's she going to? mom and dad!

so, asking for permission from the mother and father is an acknowledgement of that relationship. the guy is basically saying, i am committing myself to be like family to this lady - to support her, love her and care for her the way that her own father does and did.

(and i say "father" because they're both men. it just means more for him to ask the father, not the mother. it's a male kinship thing).

but regardless of all this... they're teenagers, so this should not even be happening. :)

good luck, lupa! okay, back to work. 

Bananas, well put...that's how I always saw it, too.  It was a show of respect to a girl's father, and the girl(s) I was usually with at the time seemed to think it was appropriate when I gained their approval for whatever the venture was.

((Lupa))

I'm a sag sun /aqua moon who drove my virgo sun/leo moon mom crazy. She was smothering and paronoid about everything. Im a free spirit all the way. Needless to say, our relationship is still wounded. But after reading your post Im thinking about giving her a call.
But she'll probably hang up. I haven't spoken to her in months.

Regarding the marriage thing... I do think this is when people start figuring out what they want and what works for them and what doesn't.  They both know they are too young to talk marriage, but the boy is very focused on partnership and my daughter is more interested in talking about travel and adventures.  

And as far as the tradition of asking the father... I think it matters what the girl you're marrying thinks about that, what her relationship is with her family and the intentions of the man doing the asking.  I'm sure it is possible to frame it the way Nutsy and Bananas describe.  It doesn't work that way for my Aq moon girl though.  In any case, that was a very minor example of how the young man is more conservative and traditionally minded than my daughter.  

Cosmickisses, my relationship with my mother is not great.  It's complicated though and it's very different from my relationship with my daughter.  Good luck with your mom.  

Lindiloo, thank you for taking so much time and thought into responding.  I'm going to go read your post again and come back to that when I can concentrate and respond.  

I see your relationship with the bright, intelligent and yes, intense Ms Virgo as strong, see her chart as not as challenged as yours is.

Years ago I had a dream about my mother and my daughter.  In the dream there was a holocaust of some sort and I was separated from my family.  My mother carried my daughter (who was a young toddler in the dream) through dangerous areas and brought her back to me.  But she was wearing her wedding band and it was contaminated with radiation.  We made her throw it away but it had scarred her.  I realized later that the dream was about the ways my mother empowered me to raise my daughter differently.  I think her life was far more challenged than mine and we are not close because she's still somewhat toxic, but I appreciate the ways that she was able to break from her past and how that changed the world for my daughter.  I'm very glad Em's chart is a little easier than mine and I hadn't really looked at it that way but you're right. 

See PLuto opposing your Venus, intensifying all of your maternal feelings and need to be there for a daughter who has flown away from your easy, caring Gemini nest, although from what i gather, she's in your life constantly, works with you?  Mine did too for a time and still would in a heartbeat..

She moved back to her dad's at the winter break so we aren't together as much as we were.  She says she plans to be here over the summer but we'll see.  I miss her a lot. 

you two have such warmth, such love so CLEAR in your charts, and I think she has the foundations she needs, rather than the ones you might wish for her.

Well she certainly has learned from me how to leave a relationship that no longer fit.  :)   I would rather she had less change and more stability but I guess maybe you're right.  Maybe this is the childhood she needed to experience. 

 I think you posted this maybe to gain the clarity an artist might get from stepping back from a lovely portrait.

Oh, thank you.  I really like that image.  I wasn't sure why I posted it except that I knew there might be things I was missing that you wise people here could help me see.   

 She's YOUR daughter...she may not be able to be with Mr Safe right now.. but that doesn't mean she'll head off in the racing car .. the shiny yellow convertible after all is HERS.. she will go her own way, I reckon. 

This is my favorite thing you've said.   

That may include career choices over the PLuto trine to her Sun/Mercury.. travel and studies ahead?

She is VERY interested in travel and she has a step dad with friends all over the world so we can help her go cool places and meet cool people.   

You're a lovely mum.. and while you can't protect her as much as you want to..the fact that you do just says tons about you..all good. XX

Thank you so much.  I really do appreciate the effort you put into this and you gave me a lot to think about.   

Just noticed sun/merc on the MC.

Mayhaps it would help if you started viewing her shenanigans as research for her books. Shes the one who will always come out unscathed to tell the story. 

Oh that's a good plan Nota.  She's a pretty decent writer now so she'll need some stories.  

Lupaloo, thank you for your generous spirited feedback. It's people like you who inspire people like me to take a couple of hours out to look at charts and give of our best.

Nota.. you ROCK!  How you can even think clearly to post in these early post natal days..wow..

Cosmickisses.. Even the fact that you want to connect with your mum brings a tear to my eye. I have a Sag daughter and her free spirit has scared me sometimes, but I so admire her on lots of levels and wish I was more like her ..  Can't comment on your mum, except Leo Moon mums need to feel/are often fiercely proud of their kids.. and in my experience rarely actually bestow that approval, assume maybe that it's understood..dunno.. I don't know your age or life stage but it feels early, and feels hopeful. Thing is that even if your mum is the she devil from hell, what matters is that you come to a place of harmony where you accept what it can't be (always hard) but find something that it can be.

Communicating might be easier on neutral terrain..meet for a coffee at Nota's and she'll sort things out I bet!! 

"How you can even think clearly to post in these early post natal days..wow.."

hahahahahaha... are you accusing me of clear thinking? I NEVER!

I don't know about you Nota but I always felt really energized when my babies were little.  I think I was so grateful not to be pregnant anymore that I didn't mind the haze of sleep dep. 

We are going to be needing new pics of that baby girl sometime! 

Lindiloo
I need to correct something I said about my mother. Actually she was already crazy to begin with. My Aqua moon complicated matters by bring out more of her demons.