Cutting through the fog is like a philadelphia cream cheese commercial until you walk into a wall you couldn't see.   

yeah, well everyone wants to blame a scapegoat.  excusing myself from this party.

chamirose- I really like Obama!, Great Spirit help him, but he has an impossible task. At least he is trying like nobody else has in many, many years! We are all weary of being AM-Bushed! 

high five rand! i feel a bit uncoformfortable praising obama on this site.

wow

Saturn and Uranus right? Saturn is the brick wall and Uranus is the Philly commercial.

" i feel a bit uncoformfortable praising obama on this site."

I don't know why.  You are in the wide, WIDE majority here, chamirose.

Hold it now. Neptune is the Philly commercial. Someone else help me here. 

the few times I have posted anything "obama" all I got was "wow" and then the thread died. and this particular thread was negative, couched in facts (polls).

I stay out politcis. and in general, i stay out of socai circles.

And I frankly dont even know why i have entered into this community. cause I dont fit into society either.  i march to my own drum and usually no one relates.  but I love astrology and needed to keep from blowing my fucking brains out. so mistake on my part this evening for even responding to a socio/politico thread.

Rand I have no fucking clue what you are talknig about. philly cheese and what not.

 maybe thats cause i dont read the news.  so pardon my ignorance.

It's just a metaphor.

Chamirose, I like the news. No, I LOVE the news. I like to watch trends in the collective, I have been this way my whole life.

I posted this to try to put some of my energy on this blog as I feel I've neglected it today and I have a sense of responsibility. I am me so when I put energy on this blog it is going to reek of me and there is nothing I can do about that.

I want you to know that it has been very hard to create a blog and a space this good. I feel really rotten when my effort is not appreciated just so you know.

There is a human being behind all this. There is one human being who has worked for 9 years and written well over 12,000 posts for no pay at all so when you characterize me as sneaky and negative... well I take it as an insult.

For the record this posts is FACT and the negative comes from you. To me the poll is positive as it shows a shift in the collective towards my point of view. 

Oh! And for the record anyone (not you in particular, chamirose) who can't tolerate a person who disagrees with them and wants to isolate themselves with like minds, this is not the place to be.  Remember I grew up with Aquarians and a grandfather who did nothing but host discussions with religious people from different faiths.

This blog is always going to represent these type values... always.

I see this as evidence of the fair-weather fandom of most Americans. We (the collective "we" in general) want to pick a winner, we want to pick someone who will give us neverending growth and prosperity. Now that reality is intruding, Americans don't like it. I don't think it would be any different if McCain or anyone else were President right now. Most candidates (and all mainstream candidates) make whatever promises they need to make to get elected. People were promised a cookie, they are pissed that their cookie got taken away, and they want their cookie back.

But they're not getting their cookie back, whether Obama is president or someone else is (even if someone out of the mainstream is elected, they still have to work with Congress, bleah). 

((rand))

I love Obama! But it is a tough beat out there, and there is no way I can even come close to agreeing with everything he says and does. In these times it will be difficult... no matter what or who, that's what I think!

Oh! I see what's happening here. Chami, your Scorpio moon has been activated! You feel "different" from everyone. Don't worry about it... it's just a mood, it will pass.

I don't mind the polls or Elsa's honest reporting.

I don't mind hanging out here with liberal thinkers, even though I lean to the right to some degree.

I call myself a Republican, but what does that mean, really? I guess I believe in Capitalism. I do. I believe in individual freedom. I don't believe that "the masses" should make the decisions for the rest of us. That is not what this country was founded on. Obama doesn't understand the constitution. He's trying to change it - he doesn't GET that the whole purpose of that document was to LIMIT government intervention. That's the KEY, that's why people from all over the world come here to make a better life for themselves, and he is going to DESTROY IT because HE DOESN'T UNDERSTAND.

You can have your opinion and I will still like you no matter what you think. But that's how I honestly see it. This country is in serious jeopardy. A new world order is coming, where the shots are called by the people with the most money. If you change the way our country is run, you just make it more difficult for the little guy to rise up from his position.

I don't want anyone telling me what I should be spending my money on. I don't want anyone taking away the money that I earned and giving it to people who are too weak to help themselves. If I want to give handouts to other people, that's my choice and it's a personal one.

I don't think it's right that a woman whose only job is being a baby factory should get money for that, and then make more babies so she can get more money. Be responsible for yourself! These programs are too readily abused by people who have no incentive. Sure they're needed but there should be some type of "work your way out " counseling or something.

I don't think government should be involved in business. 

I think people should be responsible for their own actions, and for bringing up their children to be upright, responsible citizens. I don't think it's society's job to raise/teach another person's kids.

I think affirmative action is old news and needs to go. Society has evolved past the need for such a thing. I think you should be hired not because "there needs to be a balance of different races, sexes, etc." but because you really are the best person for the job. 

I AM in favor of preserving the environment. I think the use of chemicals and pesticides is out of control and destroying us slowly.

At times I look around at society, and I see women trying to be men and men behaving as women, and it seems unbalanced, topsy-turvy and wrong. And actually, this is exactly how I live, so how's that for hypocrisy!

I don't care if other people have abortions, although I never would. My thought is that if you make abortion illegal people will just find other, more crude and dangerous means to get the job done.

I am ANTI gun control. If you take away guns from responsible citizens, it does not make the world safer. It simply means that people who have no regard for the law will still be able to get guns and control us with them.

I don't know, I couldn't resist. Sorry guys!

Hey Chami- it's ok! Let it all out.

 Off subject, but "women trying to be men" and you say you are hypocritical because you act that way too? So you're trying to be more "feminine"? Or masculine if you're a guy?

 I think there are a lot of people who think like you and, probably with Pluto in Capricorn things will edge more towards the "traditional values" side. I- I'm kinda on the side of feminism so I'm shaking a little right now, literally, ha.

Beth, if you're shaking about anything I said, don't worry about it! Principles sound great on paper but they don't work in the real world. Nothing is black or white but shades of gray.

The fastest way to make me into a feminist is to put me in a room with a group of woman-hating asshole men. Then watch how defensive of my own sex I become.

What I'm saying with the male/female thing is that traditionally, men are supposed to be aggressive and females are supposed to be receptive. The opposite appears to be happening. You take my life and what a pile of hypocrisy it is. I say I have traditionalist leanings, the world is upside down, this and that. Well, look at how I'm trying to live... in a very male fashion. I want to earn my own living, have my own house, not be tied down in relationships, I'm not married, I have no kids.

Well, all that is well and good but what about these ovaries and this uterus that God gave me to act out my female role? What's happening to them? I'm just another example of a woman acting like a man who will one day open her eyes and realize just how far she strayed from her natural intended purpose.

It's just rhetoric - my "convictions" which are just as much BS as anyone else's. Nobody lives the way they claim to when they're discussing personal beliefs. Not even fundamentalists, I bet.

We'll all still live our lives in shades of gray.

No worries- I'm not shaking about anything you said, rather responding to a lot of my own old memories and ghosts.

 IMO nobody can expect to be 100% receptive or 100% aggressive and ever hope to have a full, normal life. It's the difference that attracts us, and the overlap that keeps us together. There are differences, but not 180 degree oppositions.

 As for "traditional" roles (whose tradition?)- well, there are some to some extent, but if my right place in the world is to be bought and sold for cattle, not being able to rent an apartment for myself, or even have a self because I'm supposed to be completely selfless and supportive. No, that will not work. No matter how natural it is I can't do it.

 My ghosts- I grew up in a very traditional home. I'm a fiscal conservative, but I'm afraid one day I will realize that all religious conservatives were RIGHT and everything they said was right and that I'm a horrible person who deserves to be punished. Horribly. Lol.

So, no, it's not you. It's my own voices and echoes I was responding to.

i think people had absurdly high expectations for him.

he's not addressing my number one priority... in fact it seems like the infringements on personal liberties and addiction to government obfuscation installed by the last administration are getting worse.

meaningful change is difficult to implement on such a massive scale anyway.  spending money, that's easy.  giving a host of cash to the scavengers who feed off of any cash cow, that's easy.

I knew the public would turn on him-- no matter what he did or didn't do. Was only a matter of time. People are fickle--

(Disclaimer: not a political analyst obviously)

Beth, I agree with you. Being herded like cattle etc. will NOT work.

Even if one were to think in Fundamentalist Traditional Terms (and this is just a mental exercise - I'm not saying this is how I think it should be...)

If as a Fundamentalist Whatever, you placed male humans at the top of the food chain, they would still have a responsibility to exercise their humanity. Treating females and children as property would be morally reprehensible. It would be men blatantly not doing their jobs.

AKA, With Power Comes Great Responsibility.

I think any "good" religious fundamentalist, whatever their "rules" are would have males recognizing the limits of their personal power. 

I think that some of my views are baised based on the region where I live/grew up. In the Northeast US, people act pretty differently than they might in, say, Afghanistan. That's why it's pretty important to have the mixing pot of different viewpoints, I think.

By the way, I was rereading some of my posts and I think I'm coming across as too cavalier or something. So, sorry about the tone. I don't know much, that's for sure.

I am a (European) political scientist and just do not understand the polarization in American politics. I think the media have a lot to do with it. As an outsider looking in I am surprised at the polls changing so fast- sobering, yes, no maybe??? I find it confusing- how can the general mood shift so sudenly (especially because I can't see that Obama is doing anything different than he set out to do before elections!) You don't like general healthcare and a different tone in international politics (which the rest of the world generally thinks is a good idea), why did you vote for him in the first place?

Dina2- I agree. People with that point of view tend to make a great issue of responsibility, of gentlemanliness. Fine. But people are people. Give people legal power over others and the potential for abuse is there.

Not that the fundamentalist system doesn't work, or can't work well, but there are all kinds of situations that fall through the cracks. I...hah. I can't explain this at all. And I think this discussion is off-topic and probably irritating to people. Ha.

 Maybe if you're curious, you should reasearch- learn more about the middle east and those cultures. That's something I'm looking into right now.

ambidee- it is in part the media. Apparently, Americans have short, short attention spans. Also there's a lot of anger in the country right now from people losing jobs and whatnot.

As for voting Obama in in the first place, I think it was mostly done for the novelty.

Novelty?

"Novelty?"

Sorry, I was being flippiant. It wasn't "novelty" exactly. But I don't think the majority voted him because they understood every single one of his points and wanted him to impliment them. I think they were mostly looking for a change from Bush.

Maybe I should have said "charisma" instead of "novelty." That's closer to the mark.

Republican, Democrat, Same shit in a different package eh? We're all fucked either way. The fact that we pretend like we have any sort of power at all in terms of national government is hilarious.

high 5 alpha!

in

haha, high 5 back chamirose. my third house is in libra, i couldn't help myself.

Well, in that vein, I just found this: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091007/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama_ap_poll

Disclaimer- I am a Canadian. I just returned from a trip to the US. Aside from the trillions of dollars that have vanished, you all have nothing to worry about. It seems like a great country to me filled with a lot of really wonderful people!

PS Your media fans the flames of fear and intolerance. It's absolutely awful!  I suggest turning off your TV's. Better to go out and talk to people and to see what a truly wonderful country you have!      

hope you went somewhere fun, rand.

I love Canada - grew up across the river from Windsor & watching the Friendly Giant on CBC.

welcome home rand!  LOL!

hope you had a good trip.  {{rand}}

I hope this works Jilly!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WV2P6P4p6Hg&feature=related

OMG that is great - I just sent it to my husband so he can learn the theme song haha! Thanks!

OMG that is the scariest freakiest funniest ting ive seen since mr. rogers.  ah. you guys get my laugh muscles worked tonight!